What could be better than other peoples’ money? On this episode of Indestructible Wealth, Jack and Tyler Banta talk more about the debt that can destroy your wealth. Tune in for a hopeful and intriguing example in which a single mother turned her financial woes into a stable financial future. Listen on Spotify or Apple Podcasts!

About Indestructible Wealth: I’m Jack Gibson. I’m your wealth strategist and I’m here to help you make some money. The Indestructible Wealth Podcast is for young entrepreneurs who want to make, keep and grow wealth to enjoy now, and for years to come.

Episode #12 – How to Utilize Debt to Build a Multi-Million Dollar Portfolio with Tyler Banta

Welcome to the Indestructible Wealth Podcast. This is the place where we help young entrepreneurs to make, keep, and grow wealth that you can enjoy now, and for years to come.  I’m your host Jack Gibson, a serial entrepreneur, founder of multiple seven and eight figure businesses, and wealth building strategist.  Each week I’m going to share my tips, resources and secrets, to help you create a plan and build the life you’ve dreamed of.

Jack: All right, everybody. Welcome to the indestructible wealth show. I’ve got my special guest Tyler Banta on the line. Thank you for joining us Tyler. 

Tyler: And thank you, Jack. Thanks for having me and hello listeners. 

Jack: All right, so Tyler, the first question is, do you ever sleep its 4:45 AM there. It’s California time. And you’re out. You probably have already been up for two hours. 

Tyler: Yeah. Well, I kind of checked on ESPN had to get my juices flowing maybe watch the TV program. I don’t know, I don’t really need it.

Jack: I just don’t I need sleep. To function and you will appear to be the human that is the opposite built the opposite of me. Well, you get a lot more done, right? 

Tyler: Sometimes I think that sometimes I think opposites. So there’s that thing of just wasting time. 

Jack: Okay. Yeah. Well, all right. So it’s great to have you as we said in the introduction, you’re the master of a lot of different ways of investing and, and programs that help investors. So today we’re gonna focus a lot in diving into debt so why don’t we start off with just a foundation of how did you get started in the business? What’s your background? Tell us where how you’ve arrived at, where you’re at today.

Tyler:  Yeah, absolutely. For those of you out there that sometimes you’re looking for a pathway, you’re looking for that process to really understand how to get started in building your business, or maybe it’s just building personal wealth. One of the things that was interesting to me when I was about 16 years old, I had a little bit of money saved up and I found out I couldn’t get alone at 16 you don’t have reportable income, your income income that you made or whatever money you made was kind of a crack sheet. And it was from the Hollywood slash film industry and music industry and I got lucky in middle of a cash and it was a pretty substantial amount of cash, but all I want to do is buy real estate. And so my mom actually was the one that helped me out. She was the one that got me my first loan. And then she calls good.

Jack:  Gotta love your mom. Right? 

Tyler: Right. And a lot of people go, oh yeah that’s a silver spoon head, but really all, I was a 9.8% loan. So I don’t want to say anything was silver spoon on that one. 

Jack: Right.

Tyler: And if you take today’s interest rate environments and you compare that you’re sitting there like, wow, there’s so much opportunity out there. And so what I learned was. If there’s a way you can make an asset more valuable. And a lot of people refer to the reference of BRRR build rehab, revive and rent. That’s a great idea in concept, and it really does work but when you find value in something and you can actually take it to the next level without having to depend on anybody else and you can control your wealth. That was something that I found was a foundational component to how I started building assets and sort of building a long-term plan for myself versus something that’s an overnight throw a dart at the wall. Hopefully it sticks. 

Jack: Right. 

Tyler: And make a lot of money and I realized I got two fashions of investment when I bought this property, I got rent and I’d built equity. I took a 2 bedroom, 1 bath house that was about 1400 square feet and I turned it into a 3 bedroom 2 bath house. And it didn’t cost me a lot because I was started off as the living tenant in the beginning. And I was able to take my time to rehab it and do it myself. And for those of us that don’t have time. Look for somebody that can help you look for somebody that can be that contracting partner. And don’t try to be a fix and flip guy like on TV, the DIY stuff you see right now and the HDTV that’s all ridiculously fucking hard. 

Jack: That it’s all about Hollywood and smoke and mirrors.

Tyler: It is. Most of those guys are buying a wholesale property from one of our channels. To get their deal for the TV. In 2005 we sold like 35 houses to put this house when it first came out.

Jack: And the numbers on those shows are they, do you feel like they’re kind of fluffed up.

Tyler: Oh, no, they’re real. They’re real because what happens is BRRRR dogs are out there looking for properties for guys because they want to get noticed. Now the next 10 investors are calling them like, oh, you got so-and-so on the TV show a investment property. How about you get me some, I’ll pay you a little bit better and I’ll be a little bit better. And so they it’s almost like a marketing plan where  I’m going to make five grand on this house that has $250,000 of profit in it. And it’s the best house I’ve found in five years, but I’m going to go after it and now just basically take the loss and not enjoy the $150,000, hopefully like 50 other guys come after me. And that is what happened to a lot of guys during that era. But yeah, that’s my background. I mean, I, I essentially get started looking at real estate and wanted to explore, and then I quickly realized that I was an entrepreneur.  I didn’t want to work for anybody. I was actually a cop, a probation officer for about 5 years and worked in the juvenile system. And saw how sad it was.  And I was like, oh man my goal in there was to teach and educate these kids not only athletics and sports, because I feel that’s a foundation for every kid. It brings that comradery together. No matter your race, no matter your gender, it really does. If you’re good, you’re good. And if you could play, you could play and people respect you for it because it’s fun. Right. And I investing needs to be fun and I think education needs to be fun, but what makes it fun is what it’s relative to money. When you know there’s that green cash at the end of the table. And you know there’s that reward for all the hard work you put into it. That’s what makes it fun. And so when I left the system and kind of went out on my own. That was where I ran into a couple  with one of my business partners and she gave me a shot and said, Hey, you know what, we need help. And so I got into the financial planning industry and quickly realized there’s something wrong.

Jack: What do you mean? What was wrong? 

Tyler: 2008 had just hit, right. And I’m looking at clients accounts and I’m brand new in the business and you gotta make phone calls to clients. You gotta sit here and say, Hey, hang on. It’s coming back in. And since I’m thinking to myself like, man, I bought three rental properties at this point and every one of my rental properties is still paying and I’m sitting here telling this guy on the phone, who’s lost $400,000 of his account. Yeah just hang on. And he says to me, I don’t have much time to hang on. I need to retire in six months. Okay. And that was a reality check for me. You just don’t know what your timing is, you don’t know when you’re sick. You don’t know when you feel that you want out of the W2, your work for, even if you want to sell your company. And that was the one where I said, yeah, there’s gotta be a better way to do this. So that’s kind of where I got to now and I said I don’t want to be a financial planner anymore. I want to start focusing on real estate and I want to start focusing on how entrepreneurs and customers can keep what they work so hard for and I want to educate them on taxes I want to educate them on how lending works and I want to educate them on how to really propel their business or themselves and that’s where OPM strategies became a humongous component to what I was doing from the age of 16 which it’s not a new strategy it’s an old strategy, but it’s been perfected as the years have gone on and people have been innovative that really grab a hold of it and gravitate towards utilizing that to become rich.

Jack: Other people’s money. 

Tyler: Correct. 

Jack: So there’s a lot of the gurus out there that say pay off all debt that is bad debt. That is evil. A lot of people just, all their focus is on just getting their debt paid down. So what’s your philosophy on debt? And what’s the difference between good and bad debt?

Tyler:  Yeah, that’s an excellent question. It’s a big question, right? 

Jack: It’s a big question yeah. 

Tyler: Well, I look at any company and they don’t start without debt. They owe somebody a personal loan, or a bank loan. They have a concept. It’s an equity partner. They gave away a percentage of what it could be and at some point it’s all a form of debt. And to answer your question about good debt and bad debt, if you really understand how to utilize it and you don’t treat it with this emotion, you’re trying to buy things that you shouldn’t be buying, debt can be the most powerful tool because it all of a sudden gives you access to capital. And when building a new business or building any kind of business or brand having access to capital is key. I don’t know how many companies had cash crunch. It’s edited time and they came back and said, Hey we got to do a capital call or we gotta do a stock raise or we’ve got to issue stock to bring in cash flow. And when you look at that and you say those are all, some form of a debt, well, Good then bad it usually starts with credit cards. Clients go out or customers I should say or the consumer runs out and the first thing they typically get into is student loan debt, car debt, credit cards. Those are your first three that really rack up and credit cards are the one that kill you because the APRs are usually very, very favorable to the banks. 

Jack: Sure. 18, 20% of a lot of times. 

Tyler: Oh, I’ve yet in the last 3 days, I probably have like 40 pieces of junk mail credit card offers come through the mail for my wife and myself. One of them was 39%. 

Jack: Wow.

Tyler:  And you’re sitting here going, that’s someone taking a shot at why do you want access to capital? And how bad do you want it? 

Jack: Right. 

Tyler: And you’re sitting there going, that idea in concept of daily costs,   that interest that you are literally operating off of is not taught to us in school. When we went through high school, junior high, we learned the basic arithmetics. And you will need to learn more about debt. We need to learn more about the different types of loans that are out there to us and how they operate so that we’re knowledgeable of how to consume these products and tools because they are tools. And when you ask the question, good debt, bad debt if you can flip your debt into being tax deductible. Okay. Tax deductible. That’s the key. That’s where I found money was hidden or I was going to say not being maximized is you have a consumer credit card and you have the ability to say, Hey, throw your debt on your property and a lot of people will start to consume auto loans, credit cards, maybe soulful loans or furniture or even jewelry. And they have the ability sometimes to put it on their primary residence. And your private residence offers you a tax deduction and your primary residence is an asset that grows and it’s tied to something that creates value. So consumer that have a credit card versus a piece of property. That’s a massive difference between good debt and bad debt. Good debt being the house, bad debt being the credit card. 

Jack: Okay. So if we’re trying to build wealth, we want to be eliminating bad debt, right? The credit cards the high interest stuff, consumer debt, and we want to be embracing good debt but understanding how it works, right? Understanding the different products and things that are available to us because debt in the hands of an intelligent investor is a very good thing. It’s a wealth building tool, whereas in the hands of somebody that doesn’t know how to utilize that tool is a very, it could be a very detrimental thing for them. 

Tyler: And dangerous.

Jack: Dangerous. Yeah. 

Tyler: So it’s dangerous and it makes them destructible, not indestructible.

Jack: We didn’t start the show to create destructible wealth, right? 

Tyler: Yeah. That’s right. And I like to use scenarios of customers that have come through the systems and OPM is probably the easiest system that anybody could start out with. And I’m going to use a credit card on how people build wealth. So the customer obviously to remain anonymous, but the scenario was a single mother making about $36,000 a year. And living in the California area that’s hard to do, meaning how do you get by with 2 children and junior high and high school, both needed braces because if not going to school and probably get poked badly. Not having that pretty smile that they’d like the things that we all worry about when we’re young kids, that don’t really matter when you get older. And when we saw her file come through the system, it was odd that there was a single mom. She was living at home with her mother to get by with her 2 kids and make $36,000 a year working a 45 hour week job. There wasn’t a lot of time for her to build wealth or understand.   Grasp knowledge and so shows like this are where I think we can help people and luckily she had an uncle that referred her to our system that had had amazing success and that was what drove her in to start following the process. Well, we looked at it, she had an auto loan. She had good credit though. So that was important. She had taken her credit. They had braces of about $12,000 on the 2 kids and the payments were killing her. There was no extra money at the end of the day and we call that cashflow, like where was your cashflow at? And so she was sitting there like, what do I do? So we did a consolidation. A lot of people want to know like, Hey how, what are better ways out there to do this? So we utilize what’s called a Peloc – personal line of credit. And we got her a $20,000 peloc. She had a $16,000 auto loan and the $14,000 of braces or $12,000 of brace as well. We consolidated what we put into the peloc. And then we took all of our cash through cash flow, tied the peloc to her personal checking account and then she was able to suppress the debt every minute. So before you knew it, she was saving, interestingly because her paycheck was sitting on that peloc. But the difference between this peloc and a credit card is the peloc used to be revolving daily as your checking account. You can use it daily and all of a sudden have access to it every minute. So she could still eat normal things, pump gas, all the things that she needed to get her kids to and from school and live their daily lives. But she was saving money versus having her money sit in the bank account doing nothing for her every day that nothing for her got deposited because your bills aren’t ready to be paid day one when your paycheck comes in, they’re due the 5th, 10th, 15th, 18th, whatever. So in OPM we strategize on the actual date bills are, do these, usually give you a grace period. So every day matters. So in this scenario what we look at is she was able to consolidate the braces and majority of the car loan into this peloc, it’s an annual interest rate. So instead of having a high monthly payment of an amortized loan on the braces and the car she now had an interest only payment on the peloc that she controlled the debt based off her cash flow and within eight months she had paid everything off. 

Jack: Oh wow.

Tyler: So now we went back to the bank and we said Hey, we want to up our peloc. Look at what a good customer we are. And now she owns one asset, which is a car which is a depreciating asset. Other than that, she owns no home is not that right. No retirement plan at work. So she now turns around and says, I need to up this peloc, she has now access to $40,000.

Jack: Wow.

Tyler:  $40,000 out of nothing, right?

Jack: Right. 

Tyler: Out of a credit score. And that $40,000 all of a sudden has allowed her to purchase a rental property for $100,000. 

Jack: Did her credit score go up through this process? 

Tyler: She was averaging about an 805 score because it was just constantly working the credit score daily when you use your line of credit correctly, and you’re working out of the in and out, it shows the banks that you know how to manage and maintain that.

Jack: What was your credit score before you were?

Tyler: About  720, 740, but that’s how she got the $40,000 pelo is if she wasn’t over 780, she would’ve got it. So it’s just a little difference in the system of knowing, Hey, where do I get more money? And how do I gain? And no one teaches us how to understand our credit score. No one teaches us how to go get a peloc, a peloc different than saying, Hey, I want a credit card. Right? Completely two different types of debt. And then before it she took $20,000 out of her line put in her bank account let it sit there and get seasoned for 60 days. And now that becomes quote savings. And that’s a loophole in the lanes. That’s not taught to us because you’re not supposed to buy debt with debt. Right. And then she was able to buy a piece of property 20% down that created rent. And now here’s this property that she’s putting 20% down on a grand to $1,200 a month.

Jack: Wow.

Tyler: And then it pretty much eliminated her tax liability and that was all done through good debt to bad debt. And now she’s got deductions, she’s got a process, a system, and now she pays that off and she turned that into a line of credit as well and now she’s probably looking at buying I heard her first primary residence, so that’s just a quick scenario of good debt, bad debt that changed and was an education process for someone.

Jack: That’s amazing. So let’s do the 2 types of listeners that I have on my show. Right. I got the young Hungry entrepreneur, that’s getting started in business. Maybe they’re just getting going. Maybe they’re a few years in, maybe they saved up a bit of cash. And then I got the investor that has the resources, maybe they’re in their 40s, 50s, they’ve got a few hundred grand they’ve got a 401k. They’ve got a property or 2. We see a lot of these types of investors that come through the cash flow plus program. So let’s talk first to the younger groups. So let’s go back in time and talk to young Jack, right? The 22 year old hustling jack saved up $50,000 in college and didn’t buy anything. Just banked everything he made and he was hustling. So what advice do you have for that type of younger investor? That’s getting going, what should they be thinking about and building their wealth long-term?

 Tyler: Great. Great question. One thing that is funny to me is the banks look at young kids as obviously a liability. 

Jack: Liability. I was probably a liability.

Tyler: They see you coming in and they go, man, you changed your mind. Like the wind blows. 

Jack: Yeah. 

Tyler: And what I think is powerful is you are earning money. So one, at that time we should be taking classes on how to maximize our taxes. If we understood  taxes, going into business, say fresh out of college, or even in high school is where it really should start. You’re that much smarter as to how you earn your money and how you take your money. See we’re young. Right? The first thing he said is just, just fucking pay me, just fucking pay me. That’s all I want. Right. It’s that simple, right? 

Jack: Show me the fucking money, right?

Tyler: That’s right man, Jerry McGuire.   And you sit there you’re just going like, dude, how can I make more cash, whatever it is. So we don’t understand how to report it, how to take it in. We’re just interested in getting it, but I think you have to put a value to it. And Antwan Walker has a great basic financial education platform for his foundation. It’s called foundation aid. 

Jack: It’s called what?

Tyler: Foundation aid. Here’s a guy that made $200,000,000 plus over his career. And was probably at the top of the game selling jerseys and shoes at his time. And pretty much didn’t understand money because he left high school went to Kentucky for one year and was out, it was just a pathway or a passage. But I feel like you learned a little bit about the power of money at the age of high school? People will be that much smarter in how they take their money and realize if I earn $100, I need to put $10 aside, or I need to put $15 aside because I owe taxes. And that’s where a lot of us that are young get behind. And I even got behind you’re trying to do so much at one time trying to gather so much capital as possibly as best begin. You don’t understand how it should be allocated. You can’t use 100% of that loaf of bread. You have to say I need to slice up a couple of these here and put a little bit away for a rainy day. And then you look over here and say, Hey, is there something else on how this money can work? Do I need to pay something forward? Or as I like to say, pay myself. Yeah pay yourself first and when you bring that money in, when we’re the young Jack we’re hitting and we’re saying, how do I get more now? I get $50,000. Why don’t I have $200,000? It’s the first thing that goes through your mind and it’s getting, it goes back to the tax return. If you save too much on your taxes what don’t you qualify for? 

Jack: You can’t get a mortgage. 

Tyler: You can’t even get a loan. 

Jack: You can’t get anything. 

Tyler: You can’t get a peloc. Right? 

Jack: Right? 

Tyler: You walk in the thing like, yo give me a $40,000 on a line of credit. I can go turn that into a hundred. And that’s not the way it works. Unfortunately they want to see reportable income. So a lot of us out there are young. What are we doing? We’re taking bartending jobs. Maybe we’re strippers whatever it may be when working cash flow. 

Jack: You really went there did you?

Tyler: Yeah, I’m on pay when it works. It works now, but we were working in the bars and working in nightclubs and we are getting paid we’re making 3, $400 a night, sometimes in cash. And none of it is reportable. So I can’t maximize tenants’ money and that’s the point of what I was doing when the young Jack needed to understand how to 10 X his money. And if I can go out and show that I’m making a hard grand and I can put $3,010 down on $150,000 property, because I can use my FHA loan. I have just a hundred times my money right now. And that’s the power of OPM is you turn that 3 or $5,000 into an asset that you control and own for very little money, very little, but sometimes no money at all. For those of you that are VA that’s out there, or you can use the USDA loans. If you aren’t, a USDA area. And we’re not taught that. And that’s the problem actually with society right now is people are walking around, spending every paycheck, every time. So I think as entrepreneurs that are out there, the key is how do I get more capital to align myself with the banks? Well, number 2, you need to know the right bank to work with, all the fucking mainstream banks suck. 

Jack: They are, they’re awful. 

Tyler: They’re terrible. 

Jack: We’re never going through the loan process. They add, they asked me for a $450 home owner’s association invoice. When, well, when I have a multimillion dollar portfolio and they needed to see that that was a list of, I had a list of 30 things I had to give them. It was a terrible experience.

Tyler: You think about it. You’re probably refinancing to go from like a 4 to a 2.75. 

Jack: Right. That’s why it exists. I was just doing a cash out refinance. It was just, I already own the asset and that was worth a couple hundred thousand. I mean I didn’t have to go through all that so I thought.

Tyler: And that’s the funny part is that. You have to align yourself with a banking system that fits who you are and what you’re trying to do. And I have a great Colleague associate and friend, he had his own financial planning firm. We used to be financial advisors years ago so I do know the financial industry very well and, got rid of my firm because I just didn’t believe in it anymore. And we had a problem. It was for no reason. And when you look at it, I helped him a lot with a business bank when he was trying to build his practice to acquire other assets to build his financial planning book. I took him right into a business bank, told them how to understand the difference between an S Corp and his personal taxes because he was consolidate everything and people need to know, again, the power of 2 different pieces of paper the tax return for your corporation is not the tax return for your personal.  completely separate qualifications and tools that can get loans and turn them into a business bank and he got $180,000 line of credit in 2 weeks. Off the corporate return. There were no assets there. It was just revenue, which allowed him to buy a smart, smaller financial planner out so that he could double his book size. And then that created residual for him. So he went from a $600,000 revenue business to all of a sudden overnight about a 1.1. And it was all off of a small line of credit that allowed him to free up capital in his bank account real quick. Then he can then use that to maximize and keep growing because now when he pays that back off guess what, he can up his line, he’s got access to more capital, go do it again, or maybe buy something different and diversify his business model. And so that’s where I say the young Jack needed to understand banking and taxes to start off because sometimes we think we’re outsmarting the system. We think like, oh God, if I don’t report this cash, I’m outsmarting the system. But if you don’t work the cash that you earn, you’re not 10 Xing your money.

Jack: Yeah. Wow. Good point. 

Tyler: So there’s a younger, that’s the younger crowd, right? That’s the young Jack example.  

Jack: So you’re saying  I needed to understand the tax code much more effectively. I needed to learn how to acquire good quality debt and then learn how to then take those two concepts and go out and buy cash flow producing rental properties.

Tyler: Properties, maybe businesses, a lot of people are doing dream drop shipping with Amazon, or they’re doing side hustle ideas that are out there. One that I always found fascinating was ATM’s. I had met a lady that had a bang and business out of a mammoth one time she owned 40 ATM’s and she would only fill the ATM with about anywhere from $5,000 to $7,000, not a lot of money. Right. But she’d make 30% of her money. So these things were just printing cash over and over and over again and she had it all set up within about a 20 mile radius. So her day was just going to check on the ATMs and she could hammer it out. And then before she had her nephew doing it with her and they started expanding and then before she’s making 4 or $500,000 a year of ATM’s and you think about, wow, how hard is that as truly passive? And you’re just sitting there and it’s working for you. You’re going to go set it up. And I just know there’s several other little business ideas out there. So if you’re trying to get into something, there’s so many franchises out there that you can buy into tiny little franchises, and they’re just easy ways to create your first little business. That can become successful and allow you to do what you want to do. Rental properties though are usually the easiest way and probably the simplest thing. Most of us understand, right. We always grew up with our parents owning properties. Most of our parents tried a couple of rental properties and they’re like why did they fail? Or why didn’t they like it? And that’s typically because we’re not cut out to be real estate investors all the time as an individual but today the common knowledge is turnkey like if you can partner with a good turnkey provider and they built the property management firm, that’s everything, property management team contractors, the contractors is the hardest part of all of it. First off. 

Jack: Oh yeah. 

Tyler: Because that’s glorified babysitting. I mean you basically just clarify babysitter, chasing people and still expecting to write checks. 

Jack: Well for me personally and real estate contractors definitely cost me the most money when I first started out.

Tyler: Oh, 100%. 

Jack: That’s what most of the losses were, from shoddy work from contractors that I thought I could trust, but turns out I couldn’t.

Tyler: Oh, I mean, just last night, I got a text message. Hey, the roof is leaking, shit. Which, which address? Oh, this is Amy. I just want to sit. They were kind of fixed 2 weeks ago. 

Jack: Yeah. 

Tyler: And he told me how my whole roof was like, eh, and it was a light rain. I’m thinking like, oh God, we have a deep rain. I got to get over there. So you just sit there going like no way. Like, and that’s exactly right. Like, you just don’t know. If you’re there, they’re not tracked every single minute. What’s good contract and bad contracting? And is it going to be a short-term problem or a long-term problem? So, going into your other question about your other type of clientele.

Jack: Yeah. I was going to say, what about the guy who has resources and he’s trying to figure out how to maximize cash flow. He’s not happy with the performance of his 401k. He’s frustrated. He makes a good income, but it’s just not enough. That’s typically the scenario.

Tyler: 100%. There are 3 things that we see. They make good income and they don’t have to replace it. They’re like, I want to keep living this lifestyle while I’m retired. I don’t want to be on a fixed income. 

Jack: Sure. 

Tyler: Most people immediately think to themselves, I got to go on social security and whatever I got left over. That’s all I get. Then you have number 2, they come in and they really don’t know that their assets can perform and produce cashflow right now. You don’t know what you don’t know. And they’ve been told and shown just like the banking industry, Hey, buy a 30 year fixed loan, but that’s really not the best loan for us, the best loan a lot of times it’s an interest only loan and something that’s revolving that we have access to capital does having access to capital is how you grow at your willpower not anybody else’s, but yours. And what a lot of the 3rd  problem that a lot of people want to do is they want to just pass the buck off, stick their head in the sand and have the ostrich effect. I’m going to throw my money at someone and that sounds great. It sounds like you can get rich and I want to be part of that rich wealthy group and I’m going to be standing there having my cocktail relaxing on a paradise beach, but that’s not really how money works and I feel like if it started from a foundational aspect, people would understand the power of debt that know how to pay their houses off. They know how to pay all their assets off and have free clear assets or a way to manage their debt in retirement and create a lot of passive cash flow before they walk away from the W2.


So you were taught, save, save, save, save, save, save, save. Hopefully it’s there. And it was the same conversation I had with the gentleman who said, Hey, I got 6 months. What are you going to do about the $400,000? Right? I want to stick my head in the sand because I was brand new in the industry and say, do you see the grand? It’s fine. White sand over here. Like got me. You just send it like. Tell you six months make $400,000. I’m like maybe if you had like $6,000,000 that was invested in, we can make $4,000,000 in about six months. No problem.

Jack: That’s a big ask. 

Tyler: That was a very big ask. But also you got to look at who’s the blame of that scenario. He wanted all risky stocks because the market was on fire at that point. And I didn’t understand it. Right. I didn’t understand the objection. I’ll say whose fault is really here. So one of the big things I like to say is when you’re creating financial independence, you’re looking for that way out of that W2, or to sell your business plan ahead and really take control of your finances so that it’s a systematic process to build wealth. Don’t try to buy oil stocks. Don’t try to buy the stocks that you don’t control. Don’t try to buy real estate with a bunch of other people that you don’t really know what the hell is going on. Try to get into the stuff that you directly own, and you can physically go see and can control until you hit your first goal. Okay. When your first goal is replaced by W2 or your wife’s W2 or your spouse’s W2. That’s the goal. Get that cash flow coming in right now today. So what money in a 401k is not the answer? It’s a buy and pray method.

Jack: You do it already years before you have enough to do.

Tyler: When you retire. Is there income producing assets that are in the 401k that could provide you the same equivalents right now.

Jack: You have to start drawing down and spending the principle that’s in there. And so then your money could run out.

Tyler: Wall Street. Now, right now, publishes you should only be taken about 1.8 to 2.2% out of your retirement accounts. So if you add a $100,000 need to live on, that means you would need somewhere north of $2,200,000. To after pay tax. Right? Because we’ve got factor tax again, let’s go back to the sliced bread. I need to have $100,000 to live on to cover my nut and be comfortable otherwise I’m upside down and I’m drawn into principal because the minute you keep drawing that lifestyle and the market tanks, you’re drawn from a lower balance. 

Jack: Right.

Tyler: That means the performance has to be higher. So that means you’re set up for disaster and you’re not set up to have what your show was called?

Jack: Indestructible Wealth.

Tyler: Exactly. A foundational footprint that just keeps providing cash flow. We don’t look at cash flow assets enough. We look at returns, ROI, ROE – return on equity. We look at all of these cash on cash return cap rates. Just look at what it does for your scenario, with your cash flow. You need the factor that again by how much interest it saves you and how much cash flow you get those 3 key components. And that’s how you can build the type of wealth you’re talking about Jack, and the way your show promotes for clients. And they don’t have to take a lot of risks. They can get double digit returns if they understand those three key components and can focus that with their money. 

Jack: Okay. So. You painted the picture, what programs can create solutions like this, do you offer that? Can that help people create this cash flow of indestructible wealth?

Tyler: There are thousands of programs out there. The first thing that I always say is build the right team. That’s a program, whether you are a person that loves to work in your backyard, or you’re tired of working in your backyard because you tried all kinds of old processes. Then you need to sit here and say, Hey, what’s the next thing that I could do to really build myself as you need to first start off with a footprint of a team. And that team should consist of the most important people which is tax, a great lender or someone that can get you in front of the banking systems. And then the last is someone that really understands strategy and can really help you learn how to maneuver the entire component. Right? It’s like, how do you pull it all together? And so the program that we started is called cash flow plus and cash flow plus is very simple, Systematic process that allows people to comment and get a footprint of how they should build their plan. And it’s educational. It’s not financial planning and it allows them to take control of their money. They know what they’re buying, they know what they’re getting, they can go visit it. And there’s a lot of other solutions out there. And I like to use the phrase all the time. You don’t know what you don’t know, and if you try to piece mail it together, When the team’s not working together as a unified front, you’re typically going to have a ton of problems down the road.

Jack: So you’re saying if you try to piecemeal and in terms of, okay, I’m going to go to this person to do my taxes. I’m going to go to a whole different firm or person to try to buy properties from them. I’m going to go to this different bank to get my debt and get my loans and all of them aren’t talking to each other. None of them are working together. Then you have a potential problem with that scenario? 

Tyler: Absolutely. Absolutely. And I like to say that maybe it works 1 to 3 times, but if you’re really building indestructible, long-term systematic wealth, you’ve got to be able to do it over and over and over again,  it’s systematic. Why can’t you treat your finances like that? You have a couple of businesses. Think about it. What makes each of those work? The process is set up. The operation runs the product is delivered the same way or with tweaks based on what your consumers are asking for. It’s the same thing, same exact thing if we as consumers are asking for our money to produce cash flow to us, then why are we not focusing on that? Why are we gonna throw money at a growth ethic? A non-taxable asset. 

Everybody says, I don’t want to pay tax, but if your team is not talking to each other, you’re never going to be in the right direction. You’re going to be half-assed the entire time they sound smart. They’ll tell you, oh, I’ll talk to you rather than die for you. There goes a bill coming your way, just be prepared. And then the 2nd poll component is my favorite question is ask your tax advisor, how many pieces of property they bought? How many investments are they doing right now, what are they doing with their cash? Ask your lender. What type of loan do you utilize? These every loan out there known to man, they’re shopping the rates for you. They’re doing whatever they can, because they can sell you another loan down the road. And they see this. Why not let the industry professional that’s licensed that did all the work, give you the right formula and most of us want to follow what’s on the TV also just want to follow what’s posted in the banks. Why is it posted? If you’re a business owner, why do you post certain ads and certain offerings? Because typically it is the most profit they will produce. And that’s why we buy 30 year fixed loans. And that’s why we buy the stocks that we buy. And that’s why we buy X. 

Jack: Yeah. They’re pushing you towards the things that they can generate the biggest spreads.

Tyler: Yeah. They’re in business to make money. We’re not in business to sit there. 

Jack: So. Last question. And then my 11 year old, Tyler’s going to be coming in. Come on dad. We got to get to school. I’m taking him so my wife can hit her workout class and stay super hot and fit. What’s the question that I should ask you, but I didn’t?

Tyler: You told me you like to preach safety and I think we, the sensible, well, yeah, safety first is a big factor. Now what do you want as an investor?  Where you want to go?  Where you want to be and the numbers don’t lie, like run the numbers and make sure, oh, I can get there, but I think there’s always a variable factor. There’s always a loss factor. What’s your worst case scenario? If you go into every investment or every partnership, knowing how to exit. And knowing how to lead the investment and what you walk away with in the worst case scenario, you’ll always be in a safety position. And I think that’s the best attitude to have is that nothing’s perfect. And for those people out there that hire them, financial advisor and I think, oh, this guy’s doing a great job and he’s really not. Don’t blame him, blame yourself because you didn’t know, you didn’t educate, you didn’t look at what’s available to you.  And that would be my safety first crossing guard advice to this financial industry. 

Jack: So people would like to work with you, Tyler and work with an integrated system and processes where all the teams are already talking to each other, what do they need to do to be able to access your knowledge, wisdom, and this whole team of people.

Tyler: We have awesome systems set up. We have a great network. It is relatively new because we had to pull it all together after the years and years of learning, what was good and what was wrong but I would see there are several channels where they can enter the cash flow plus.

Jack: So essentially getting the cashflow plus it’s right, 

Tyler: correct. Yep, exactly. And that would then drive them to the 1st steps. And typically we always start off with our OPM strategy because this is the core. To having access to capital. Once you have access to capital, you could triple 10 extra money and you could really grow to the next level. 

Jack: Awesome. Very good. Tyler, thank you so much for all your wisdom for the listeners out there with just really hit the tip of the iceberg and tapping into Tyler’s knowledge and experience. So you can absolutely plan that. We’ll have him back on the show I’m sure that we’ll talk about tax strategies in another episode we’ll talk about lazy assets, so we’ll definitely, we’ll be back very soon with more content from Tyler. So thank you so much for being here everybody. That’s a wrap for the indestructible wealth show. We’ll see you on the next episode. Thanks Tyler.

Tyler: Thank you.

That’s a wrap for this episode on the Indestructible wealth podcast. Before we part ways, I want to help you to take advantage of 2 incredible tax saving strategies that could help you save a lot of money.  All you have to do is leave me a 5 star review – if I’ve earned it – and comment in iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify, or wherever you tune in. After you’ve done that simple step, just email me a screenshot to [email protected] and I’ll send you everything you need to save money on your taxes for years to come.  If you’d like to dive deeper into your own wealth building strategy, check us out at myindestructiblewealth.com and follow along on social media. Also, please share this podcast with anyone who’s looking for guidance on their own wealth building journey. Until next time, remember our mission here is to help you make, keep, and grow wealth you can enjoy now, and for years to come.

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